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Uber fares are 'default fares' to be used if a fare is not negotiated...

3947 Views 79 Replies 17 Participants Last post by Michael - Cleveland, Feb 10, 2016

Michael - Cleveland

Discussion Starter · Sep 27, 2015 (Edited)

Both the partner agreement and the user agreement specifically say the fares are 'default fares' to be used if a fare is not negotiated between the driver and the rider.

...you and the Company shall always have the right to negotiate a Service Fee different from the pre-arranged fee.
The purpose of the pre-arranged Service Fee is only to act as the default fee in the event neither party negotiates a different amount.

So, go ahead -
Tell your next rider that you charge a $5 pick-up fee in addition to whatever Uber charges.
Get them to send 'I AGREE TO A $5 Fee' to you by txt ...
and then request a fare adjustment from Uber at the end of the trip.

Document the email exchange you have with the CSR that refuses to increase the fare...
and then send it all to Lis-Riordin if Uber either refuses to charge the fee and pay it to you - or deactivates you.

THAT's the lawsuit I want to see.

@chi1cabby and

@Another Uber Driver ... what do you think?

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Michael - Cleveland

Discussion Starter · #41 · Oct 1, 2015

thehappytypist said:
If you write in asking us to add tip, or even if a rider writes in to add a tip, we aren't allowed to do it... It's nuts that they would even have that in the agreement if there's no way to do it without getting into trouble. It's lip-service and misleading.

What is nuts is not having a way to do it but having it in the agreement. Nuts, and legally it is "Restraint of Trade".

Michael - Cleveland

Discussion Starter · #42 · Oct 1, 2015

CommanderXL said:
Yeah, but the next line defines "negotiated fare" so that you can only lower the fare:

You shall always have the right to: (i) charge a fare that is less than the pre-arranged Fare; or (ii) negotiate, at your request, a Fare that is lower than the pre-arranged Fare (each of (i) and (ii) herein, a "Negotiated Fare"). Company shall consider all such requests from you in good faith.

It doesn't say "only". That is just what Uber wants you to think.

You have to remember that just because an agreement or contract says something, doesn't mean it is binding, or legal... especially if the contract is drafted by one party that has a 'superior' position. Federal Judge Chen has written about this at some length.

Reactions: 1

thehappytypist

· #43 · Oct 1, 2015

SCdave said:
It's 2am. A PAX has been cancelled on 3 times in a row because the Driver won't drive 40 miles into the country side (under serviced or basically no service area). 4th Uber Driver shows up and PAX says, "Man, I just got cancelled on 3 times. I know the rates are low and the 40 miles to take me home is actually an 80 mile trip for you, the Driver. I want to pay more, h*ll, it's cheap for me at twice the fare, but I don't have any cash on me".

thehappytypist , how does the Uber Driver handle this in a professional manner that will make the Uber Customer happy?

The rider would have to give you cash or you use your own swipe thing because we won't add anything to the fare even at the rider's request. This entire situation hinges on whether you trust the rider not to write a complaint about it afterward, I'm sure it happens frequently. If they willingly give you cash at the time but afterwards they write to support, we're going to be bugging you about it.

thehappytypist

· #44 · Oct 1, 2015

SCdave said:
Who decides "if the fare should have been higher"? The App Technology / Credit Card Processing Company or the Transportation Provider?

It's entirely up to support, based on whatever the policy is that second.

Reactions: 2

merkurfan

· #45 · Oct 1, 2015

thehappytypist said:
The rider would have to give you cash or you use your own swipe thing because we won't add anything to the fare even at the rider's request. This entire situation hinges on whether you trust the rider not to write a complaint about it afterward, I'm sure it happens frequently. If they willingly give you cash at the time but afterwards they write to support, we're going to be bugging you about it.

So they can email and complain they paid more in cash with no proof of the transaction and you'd listen to them? wait.. what?

Casuale Haberdasher

· #46 · Oct 1, 2015

Michael - Cleveland said:
yeah... of course.
but I'm an old guy with no agenda here.
(which is why you'll see me trying to explain to new drivers the reasoning behind a lot of Uber's practices almost as much as I ***** about those same practices)

POST # 10/Michael - Cleveland: An
exemplary display
of Comity AND Maturity by the De Facto
"Great Great-Laker".
Well-done Fellow Notable !

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thehappytypist

· #47 · Oct 1, 2015

merkurfan said:
So they can email and complain they paid more in cash with no proof of the transaction and you'd listen to them? wait.. what?

No, we always get in touch with the driver first to ask about it. Either by phone or email.

merkurfan

· #48 · Oct 1, 2015

thehappytypist said:
No, we always get in touch with the driver first to ask about it. Either by phone or email.

somehow i don't think it ends well for the driver..

wait.. support people have phones?? how come all we can do is send an email in to the abbis and wait for a reply?

Reactions: 1

Casuale Haberdasher

· #49 · Oct 1, 2015

thehappytypist said:
It's entirely up to support, based on whatever the policy is that second.

POST # 44 /thehappytypist: Dateline
2020/ Silicon Valley in
Greater Kalanickistan..............................

Tech Party Presidential Candidate
#Travis K. Whatapr♤♡k! announced
today the following:

☆ ☆ ☆ POLICY BY ROBOTIC FIAT ☆ ☆ ☆
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Bison: I'll wait for the UPNetFlix Release!

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SCdave

· #50 · Oct 1, 2015

thehappytypist said:
The rider would have to give you cash or you use your own swipe thing because we won't add anything to the fare even at the rider's request. This entire situation hinges on whether you trust the rider not to write a complaint about it afterward, I'm sure it happens frequently. If they willingly give you cash at the time but afterwards they write to support, we're going to be bugging you about it.

Why?

Reactions: 1

Fuzzyelvis

· #51 · Oct 1, 2015

SCdave said:
It's 2am. A PAX has been cancelled on 3 times in a row because the Driver won't drive 40 miles into the country side (under serviced or basically no service area). 4th Uber Driver shows up and PAX says, "Man, I just got cancelled on 3 times. I know the rates are low and the 40 miles to take me home is actually an 80 mile trip for you, the Driver. I want to pay more, h*ll, it's cheap for me at twice the fare, but I don't have any cash on me".

thehappytypist , how does the Uber Driver handle this in a professional manner that will make the Uber Customer happy?

Well I'm not her but I'd say tip me big on my square reader...

Reactions: 1

Fuzzyelvis

· #52 · Oct 1, 2015

Michael - Cleveland said:
Well we know that's not true, because they put the SRF in the fare without charging us a commission on that fee.

I didn't say they couldn't do it I told you what they'd say. We know they can. It's in the taxi app.

Reactions: 1

Michael - Cleveland

Discussion Starter · #53 · Oct 1, 2015

Casuale Haberdasher said:
POST # 10/Michael - Cleveland: An
exemplary display
of Comity AND Maturity by the De Facto
"Great Great-Laker".
Well-done Fellow Notable !

<blush>

Reactions: 2

Fuzzyelvis

· #54 · Oct 1, 2015

thehappytypist said:
No, we always get in touch with the driver first to ask about it. Either by phone or email.

And we know to deny a rider ever gave us cash if uber contacts us. Everyone got that?

Reactions: 1

Michael - Cleveland

Discussion Starter · #55 · Oct 1, 2015 (Edited)

thehappytypist said:
The rider would have to give you cash or you use your own swipe thing because we won't add anything to the fare even at the rider's request. This entire situation hinges on whether you trust the rider not to write a complaint about it afterward, I'm sure it happens frequently. If they willingly give you cash at the time but afterwards they write to support, we're going to be bugging you about it.

I've got to say, fare adjustments at the request of both the rider and the driver (ie: negotiated) are not just the stated policy in the Uber TOS and driver agreements, they are supported by law (if Uber is in fact only a technology company and 'third party payer - as defined in the agreements and TOS).

For Uber to pass on a policy to the CSRs to deny any such mutually agreed upon fare adjustment,
is a breach of contract and likely illegal.

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Michael - Cleveland

Discussion Starter · #56 · Oct 1, 2015

seriously:
I LOVE THIS THREAD!
(thank you to the many thoughtful and serious participants)

Reactions: 2

Michael - Cleveland

Discussion Starter · #57 · Oct 1, 2015

Fuzzyelvis said:
I didn't say they couldn't do it I told you what they'd say. We know they can. It's in the taxi app.

exactly - and excellent point.

Reactions: 1

thehappytypist

· #58 · Oct 1, 2015

Fuzzyelvis said:
And we know to deny a rider ever gave us cash if uber contacts us. Everyone got that?

Yeah, we're well aware that not all drivers are being truthful about it but we have no way of proving otherwise. We just document it on both sides (riders are not above lying about cash exchanges...or anything else), rider gets up to the amount of their fare refunded, driver's fare is left alone, and case closed.

Reactions: 2

Michael - Cleveland

Discussion Starter · #59 · Oct 1, 2015 (Edited)

thehappytypist said:
Yeah, we're well aware that not all drivers are being truthful about it but we have no way of proving otherwise. We just document it on both sides (riders are not above lying about cash exchanges...or anything else), rider gets up to the amount of their fare refunded, driver's fare is left alone, and case closed.

I do wish more drivers would understand the point of what you said: CSRs are somewhat empowered to just make all parties happy... even if it means crediting the rider and not deducting from the driver... to Uber, it costs less to make a $5 adjustment than to pay a CSR $10/hr answering endless emails. And this is why drivers need to be persistent (and hopefully not abuse the system).

Reactions: 1

thehappytypist

· #60 · Oct 1, 2015

SCdave said:
Why?

In short, because Uber is ALL about the rider. One of the major selling points is not needing to pull out a card or cash and they don't want to jeopardize that. So they decide to have their cake and eat it too - include it in the partner agreement so it looks like an independent contractor relationship (which we all know it's not) but then deactivate those who do negotiate and exchange money outside the app.

The longer I work here, the more ridiculous it all gets. I'm starting to send out resumes and am eagerly waiting to hear back from SOMEbody so I can gtfo.

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