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I was actually replying to someone who made an unsupported statement. AND I asked them to provide evidence. They still haven't. No one still has. You all just keep spinning fantasy webs.
And your response contained an unsupported statement. Please cite the authority that supports your statement or admit you had no basis for making the statement. I don’t care what you asked the OP for. You need to support the statements you made in the same manner you are demanding of others or admit you are just spouting off.
 

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And your response contained an unsupported statement. Please cite the authority that supports your statement or admit you had no basis for making the statement. I don’t care what you asked the OP for. You need to support the statements you made in the same manner you are demanding of others or admit you are just spouting off.
Why doesn't the OP have to back their claims but I have to back mine? That's a double-standard.
 

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I am literally the most sane, sensible, rational and well-educated person in this whole discussion.

And I can see how that threatens this entire pit of ignorance and apathy.
Damn..them Soyboys always think too highly of themselves. So next up you'll tell us how learned and sophisticated you are cause you have a yearly subscription to the NY times & the WSJ, amirite?!

BTW.. are you in any way related to this guy "the Italian" because, he too, always thinks he's the smartest, most sensible, most educated guy in any discussion he's engaged in 😹😹🤡🤡🤡😹😹
 

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You can thank your fellow liberals for allowing these bail reforms and letting 100000's of these hood rats back in the streets to either rob or shoot or steal. Two drivers carjacked in Manhattan less than an hour apart looks like it was an uber driver, what a great nation we are going to be.
'
Last night around 11pm in Jamaica queens had a guy in a mask and hoodie come right upto my driver side door. I was posted up by a hydrant just scrolling thru my phone and notice him standing looking in. It was an empty residential block with no one around and barely any streetlights. I literally didnt take any chance rolling down my window and just put into drive and drove off. Maybe im paranoid or probably avoided a robbery or who knows.
 

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Cant be as bad as mine, i took my regular, well guy that buys his dope in kensington (Phila) and comes back, pays me 240$ cash. I waited for 10 mins surrounded by burning trash cans, zombies and rats the size of a bear. And everyone though i was a cop. There were burnt car remains and trash to the knees, there were so much police and yet i ran most stop signs. The BS i gotta do when its dead slow.
 

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Discussion Starter · #109 ·
Last night around 11pm in Jamaica queens had a guy in a mask and hoodie come right upto my driver side door. I was posted up by a hydrant just scrolling thru my phone and notice him standing looking in. It was an empty residential block with no one around and barely any streetlights. I literally didnt take any chance rolling down my window and just put into drive and drove off. Maybe im paranoid or probably avoided a robbery or who knows.
You not paranoid. Never ever roll windows down. One guy hit a Chinese uber driver in the eye after he rolled his window down to answer a guy in Manhattan and he lost one eye. It's only God who keeps us safe.
 

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The huge amount of gun crime in the US is evidence that all this country has achieved in this respect is to arm its criminal community. The solution is clear - every single person, upon reaching the age of 12 in the US, should receive a government issued semi-automatic pistol. For a start, this would put an immediate end to all school shootings that are such a feature of this country. Imagine how long an active shooter would last if he went into a classroom filled with 12 year olds who all had in their backpacks a Glock with one in the chamber and ready to fire. Not very long! is the answer.

This would also solve issues such as this Burger King shooting. Instead of depending on the police to catch criminals after the fact, members of the public inside restaurants or out on the street etc could simply pick up their guns and execute suspects immediately.

People in positions of authority such as teachers, shift supervisors in restaurants, bus drivers etc etc should be issued fully automatic assault rifles which they would be encouraged to take to work with them.

It is only through having a fully-armed public that the USA can ever hope to reap the full benefits of its liberal gun rights as enshrined in and protected by the Constitution, and thereby realise a safe and healthy society that is free from gun crime.
Giving 12 year olds guns will only increase gun crime I think. They are more likely to be trigger happy and start shooting everyone. For schools they should have armed security and metal detectors, and depending on how bad the school is they should adjust their level of security. Teachers and other staff should be armed too.
 

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The argument that if there were no guns in circulation, there would be no gun crime is obviously correct, by definition. However, this argument is all well and good, but it is of no practical use to anyone. Disarming Americans will never happen due to the fact that guns and shooting people are an inextricable part of American culture and American identity. The Founding Fathers considered guns to be so important to the fabric of the new country that they cemented the right to carry them into the Constitution. This is very unusual (the US is one of only three countries in the world to do this) but perhaps understandable given the real risk at that time of the British returning to try to recolonise the territory.

Of course, the Founding Fathers did not intertwine the gun with the definition of America in order that, 230 years later, regular American citizens could go around shooting each other, in acts of crime. They evidently did not predict this eventuality, nor did they predict the developments in society that would mean that the average citizen would eventually no longer need to protect themself with firearms against tyrannical governments in their own territory. Interestingly, I saw a poster write above that he believed that Australians should not have given up their guns because they could have used them against the Australian government when it imposed mask mandates and Covid restrictions. That kind of thinking is a fascinating direct cultural carry-down from the perspective held 230 years ago in 1791 during the time of American (and also French) revolutions. It's amazing that Americans still think along those lines, even though they are clearly antiquated. As evidenced by recent events, attempts to challenge the institution of government by force nowadays in the 2020s, when Americans stormed their own Congress, results in outrage from the public and the perpetrators put in jail as criminals. In the modern age, if one wants to change the government, one runs for office and tries to change it from within, instead of picking up a musket and joining a militia.

Returning to the olden days, guns were also a requirement for pioneers who wanted to survive the so-called American Indian conflicts as the new Americans pushed the native Americans off their lands in what would be the wild west and the deep south. Guns soon became a defining feature of American culture, from the beginning of the country and they have been ever since. This can easily be seen in who the American folk heroes and anti-heroes were and are - gunfighters feature heavily throughout: Wyatt Earp, Doc Holliday, Jessie James from the Wild West era to Elliot Ness, Al Capone, Machine Gun Kelly and Bonnie & Clyde in the 20th century, through to the modern day fictional shoot-em-up characters inspired by them who could only ever be created in America by Americans: Dirty Harry, practically any character ever played by Al Pacino, Indiana Jones, John McClane (Diehard), the entire genre of Western movies, etc etc. Even the more ridiculous gun-toters like the Terminator and Rambo could only have been dreamed up in the USA.

Americans start indoctrinating their children from a very young age in gun culture. While other countries feature cartoons and children's shows featuring characters that are farm animals or clowns etc, the US features the likes of rootin' tootin' shootin' Yosemite Sam and Elmer Fudd, who shoot at other cartoon characters each week with pistols, shotguns or machine guns. By associating soft and fluffy cartoon characters with guns and showing cartoon shootings to young children, children are eased into accepting firearms and shootings as normal parts of life.

Criminals in the US commonly see guns as a necessary part of their trade. On the other side of the criminal divide, American individualism combined with the romanticised gun cultural image of the lone gunslinger fighting off the bad guys results in the types of attitudes that we see right here in this thread. That if a bad guy squares up to me with a gun, I will take out my .45 and blow his head clean off, Clint Eastwood style.

So, Americans will never give up their guns. It's never going to happen. It's too late for that, and it has been too late for that ever since 1791. That horse has bolted. There are options, though, for non-gun people if they want to minimise their chances of having someone try to shoot them or pull a gun on them. Staying away from and not living in the worst-affected cities and areas is obviously the most sensible. If you're raising a family, then look for somewhere with low crime statistics.

Incidentally, the clip below from the movie LA Story is comedy, but it's an accurate description of where the US is headed:
Is that Steve Martin? Hahaha!
 

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Giving 12 year olds guns will only increase gun crime I think. They are more likely to be trigger happy and start shooting everyone.
The problem with that is that the Constitution does not put a minimum age requirement on freedom. Once you go down the route of disarming children, where does it end? Once the Looney Left got hold of that idea, they would then want to increase the minimum age for ensuring one's own safety from 12, to 14, 16, to 20 and then to 25 and 30 etc etc.

Cars are just as dangerous as guns, and children can drive from the age of 16. So the government-issued .45 caliber semi automatics should be definitely be distributed universally at this age, at the most. If kids are able to go out and drive a lethal Corolla at 16, then we can definitely entrust them with a Glock.
 

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The problem with that is that the Constitution does not put a minimum age requirement on freedom. Once you go down the route of disarming children, where does it end? Once the Looney Left got hold of that idea, they would then want to increase the minimum age for ensuring one's own safety from 12, to 14, 16, to 20 and then to 25 and 30 etc etc.

Cars are just as dangerous as guns, and children can drive from the age of 16. So the government-issued .45 caliber semi automatics should be definitely be distributed universally at this age, at the most. If kids are able to go out and drive a lethal Corolla at 16, then we can definitely entrust them with a Glock.
With the constitution there are limits, of course. If these kids were out in a rural area filled with bandits and wild animals, of course they should be armed. There are situations where they can be armed and situations where they can't. Giving a 12 year old a pistol to take to school in a city is different than giving a pistol to a 12 year old in Montana in charge of taking care of a large piece of property.

One reason why gun laws in New York are so strict is because of the large population here. I once argued with some relatives who are anti-guns. One told me "But what if you shoot at someone and you end up hitting someone else. There are alot of people in New York City." While they have a point, that is why I think that people who want to be gun owners should pass training classes from the government so that they have good marksmanship skills.

The constitution does give people the right to bear arms, but I think they should bear arms if necessary. A store clerk bearing arms is different than a 12 year old carrying a gun to school, where there is a risk of needless shooting going on.

In less populous US States, I think one of them is Montana, kids aged 13 or 14 can drive cars. That is understandable, as there is less people there, and stores and other buildings need to be reached by car, as they may be far away and there is no public transportation. Cars were not meant to be used as weapons.
 

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Why doesn't the OP have to back their claims but I have to back mine? That's a double-standard.
I’m not talking to the OP. He didn’t do the stupid prove it argument. You did. If you think that line of arguing is valid cite your proof or admit you were just spouting off.
 

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Really? How often? What percentage of the time to robbers kill the ones they rob?

I ask this because I am 100% certain you don't actually know how often and I bet if you google it, it's a really small number.

I'd never try to defend my stuff with my life.

Here's your answer. You are wrong in your assumption the # is small.

Robbery of Convenience Stores
Harms Resulting From Convenience Store Robbery"

Convenience store employees suffer from high rates of workplace homicide, second only to taxicab drivers.
 

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Here's your answer. You are wrong in your assumption the # is small.

Robbery of Convenience Stores
Harms Resulting From Convenience Store Robbery"

Convenience store employees suffer from high rates of workplace homicide, second only to taxicab drivers.
Wow. That's amazing. You cherrypicked convenience store homicides to try to prove your point, and the data is ancient, weak, and not very compelling. Here's the text I found regarding the claim above:

"Homicide ranks as one of the leading types of occupational injury in the United States, accounting for over 1100 worker deaths in the most recent year. In the period 1980 - 1989, the rate of employee homicide was reported as 8,0 per 100,000 with 15 percent of these homicides resulting from gunshots. After taxicabs, convenience stores have the highest prevalence of workplace homicide (NIOSH, 1993) and also have very high rates of robbery. This has prompted leaders of the convenience store industry, public health officials, and criminal justice practitioners to search for ways to reduce these rates and enhance the safety of convenience store workers."

OK so the data is old AF and occupational injury is looked at as a total among all occupations, and it's 8 in 100,000. Those are rookie numbers. And that's for all occupations, not just convenience stores.

The statement "Convenience store employees suffer from high rates of workplace homicide" means relative to other occupations, convenience store employees are the 2nd most likely to be murdered.

It says nothing about how many of those are from robberies.

I dug a little more and found some even older data (1973-84) because newer data of these statistics appears to be hard to find.

On this report it says that out of 1,223,400 robberies, 77,600 resulted in 'serious' injury (unfortunately there's nothing to indicate death, but let's assume it does for the sake of argument).

Conclusion:
Up to 0.06% of robberies may result in serious injury (and presumably this includes homicide).


Wow that number is actually suuuuuuuper low.

Case closed.

I'll stick to just letting them take stuff that I can replace instead of gambling my life for it.
 

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OK I found newer data but it's specific to post-Katrina New Orleans.

Closer look at New Orleans armed robberies reveals when, how frequently they result in shootings | Crime/Police | nola.com

"This chart shows that between 5 and 8 percent of shooting incidents in any given year since 2011 have been due to robbery, only 2.5 to 5 percent of armed robberies end in a shooting, and between 5 and 10 percent of homicide victims are killed as the result of a robbery."

Yeah, even at these rates I'm still good on trying to defend my stuff with my life.
 

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Wow. That's amazing. You cherrypicked convenience store homicides to try to prove your point, and the data is ancient, weak, and not very compelling. Here's the text I found regarding the claim above:

"Homicide ranks as one of the leading types of occupational injury in the United States, accounting for over 1100 worker deaths in the most recent year. In the period 1980 - 1989, the rate of employee homicide was reported as 8,0 per 100,000 with 15 percent of these homicides resulting from gunshots. After taxicabs, convenience stores have the highest prevalence of workplace homicide (NIOSH, 1993) and also have very high rates of robbery. This has prompted leaders of the convenience store industry, public health officials, and criminal justice practitioners to search for ways to reduce these rates and enhance the safety of convenience store workers."

OK so the data is old AF and occupational injury is looked at as a total among all occupations, and it's 8 in 100,000. Those are rookie numbers. And that's for all occupations, not just convenience stores.

The statement "Convenience store employees suffer from high rates of workplace homicide" means relative to other occupations, convenience store employees are the 2nd most likely to be murdered.

It says nothing about how many of those are from robberies.

I dug a little more and found some even older data (1973-84) because newer data of these statistics appears to be hard to find.

On this report it says that out of 1,223,400 robberies, 77,600 resulted in 'serious' injury (unfortunately there's nothing to indicate death, but let's assume it does for the sake of argument).

Conclusion:
Up to 0.06% of robberies may result in serious injury (and presumably this includes homicide).


Wow that number is actually suuuuuuuper low.

Case closed.

I'll stick to just letting them take stuff that I can replace instead of gambling my life for it.

1) I went with the first report from a corroborated source; I didn't cherry pick it, though appears you did for your selected passages. I picked a .edu piece, which means it's reputable and certainly not weak. Doesn't look like you understand the process of published sources.
WHAT is the difference on the age of the report??? YOU THINK CRIME LEVELS WENT DOWN WITH TIME????

2) It did NOT say they result in high rates compared to other occupations. It said they result in HIGH rates, Period. Good try in manipulating the evidence though.

As that report and SEVERAL OTHERS showed, robberies of places like convenience stores result in a high rate of death to those being robbed. Which is what you denied. Feel free to go on believing your incorrect perspective in the face of evidence to the contrary.
I don't live with you, so your opinion is of no consequence to me. You do you.
 

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You ignored everything I said and the evidence I provided just so you could be right. Glorious. It's been real.
 
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