Uber Drivers Forum banner
  • Enter Our Dog Days of Summer BBQ Giveaway Now! ENDING SOON

Where should the Ostrich coat go after the trial?

  • 1. The Smithsonian Museum

    Votes: 3 9.7%
  • 2. The Madame Tussauds Wax museum with Manafort wax likeness wearing it.

    Votes: 9 29.0%
  • 3. Presented as a gift to Paul Ryan upon his retirement.

    Votes: 19 61.3%
Status
Not open for further replies.
1521 - 1540 of 2469 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,352 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,521 ·
I heard it twice so I can't quote exactly. Just tune in to Wilkow or something, you'll see what I'm talking about
Or instead of us digging for something only you seemed to have heard/saw, why not type up exactly what you heard/saw to back this up. Even post an article if you'd like.

djino
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
473 Posts
Lol Bernie put his foot in his mouth a dozen times and they've been ripping him to shreds on Fox since
I've watched Bernie at the town hall and have to agree with djino's/Kurt Halfyard's assesments of his performance.
Sounds like you just grazed over whichever "alternate facts" Wilkow was espousing. Just another right-wing, Hannity-type fruit-loop who starts screaming "socialism" when anyone suggests improvements to the status quo. Jeez!! it's disappointing to realize how many people suffer from Dunning-Kruger effect. Are they all Trump voters?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
66 Posts
I've watched Bernie at the town hall and have to agree with djino's assesment of his performance.
Sounds like you just grazed over whichever "alternate facts" Wilkow was espousing. Just another right-wing, Hannity-type fruit-loop who starts screaming "socialism" when anyone suggests improvements to the status quo. Jeez!! it's disappointing to realize how many people suffer from Dunning-Kruger effect. Are they all Trump voters?
He might agree with Hannity on most points, that doesn't make him a fruit-loop. And they're right, Bernie said it himself, he's a democratic socialist.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,998 Posts
Reptilians fear Biden the most, there gonna prop - up Bernie for now cause they want him to get the democratic nod. Then they will say he is a hypocrite cause he is now a millionaire. They fear Biden cause people see stability in Biden, something that missing in Trump & Bernie
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,352 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,527 ·
Reptilians fear Biden the most, there gonna prop - up Bernie for now cause they want him to get the democratic nod. Then they will say he is a hypocrite cause he is now a millionaire. They fear Biden cause people see stability in Biden, something that missing in Trump & Bernie
That may be correct from a conservative perspective, but from a liberal perspective, I completely disagree.

Biden represents the establishment (aka Obama, Hillary Clinton), keeping the status quo, not someone to rock the boat against corporate interest. Even though there are interdependents and conservatives that could possibly vote for Biden over Trump, there wouldn't be enough for Biden to win the presidency because much of the progressive wing of Democratic base would likely stay home or vote third party (aka, a repeat of 2016) as Biden likely wouldn't speak to progressive issues.

Democrats simply need to repeat what they did during the recent 2018 midterm elections that was the biggest wave ejection since Watergate. The newly elected Democratic politicians spoke to progressive issues like Medicare for all, the Green New Deal, criminal justice reform, etc. This brought out the Democratic voters in record numbers to secure a 40 seat gain in the House. These are all because of the progressive issues that Democrats campaigned on that Biden has been on the wrong side of if you take a look at his voting record.

Yes Biden could now have evolved and could jump into the presidential race by saying he is now for all of these progressive proposals like Medicare for all, but he may not be believed by Democratic voters and/or conservatives and independents may think that therefore makes him too extreme.

These are the reasons why I do not believe Biden will be successful. And it's likely the reason why he has yet to jump in the race (still weighing his options). Remeber this isn't his first time running for president, he ran back in 2008 and lost the primary to Obama).

Djino
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,998 Posts
This
That may be correct from a conservative perspective, but from a liberal perspective, I completely disagree.

Biden represents the establishment (aka Obama, Hillary Clinton), keeping the status quo, not someone to rock the boat against corporate interest. Even though there are interdependents and conservatives that could possibly vote for Biden over Trump, there wouldn't be enough for Biden to win the presidency because much of the progressive wing of Democratic base would likely stay home or vote third party (aka, a repeat of 2016) as Biden likely wouldn't speak to progressive issues.

Democrats simply need to repeat what they did during the recent 2018 midterm elections that was the biggest wave ejection since Watergate. The newly elected Democratic politicians spoke to progressive issues like Medicare for all, the Green New Deal, criminal justice reform, etc. This brought out the Democratic voters in record numbers to secure a 40 seat gain in the House. These are all because of the progressive issues that Democrats campaigned on that Biden has been on the wrong side of if you take a look at his voting record.

Yes Biden could now have evolved and could jump into the presidential race by saying he is now for all of these progressive proposals like Medicare for all, but he may not be believed by Democratic voters and/or conservatives and independents may think that therefore makes him too extreme.

These are the reasons why I do not believe Biden will be successful. And it's likely the reason why he has yet to jump in the race (still weighing his options). Remeber this isn't his first time running for president, he ran back in 2008 and lost the primary to Obama).

Djino
[/QUOTE
At this point I will take any democrat, even
Aventti/Stormy 2020 baby
I will take anyone other than spincter Aventti/Stormy 2020 baby
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,727 Posts
Bernie is such a classy guy! How refreshing to hear actual policy instead of the populist crap that we are getting these days.

The town hall seemed stacked but I guess that's how political polarization works. Regions self-sort themselves into tribes. It's a very unhealthy thing for a polity.

I liked that Bernie attacked the Citizen's United ruling. That allowed corprate money to, in Bernie's words, "buy elections". If the democrats win in 2020 I hope the first thing they do is to stop all that corporate money polluting the politics.

I particularly liked that the audience immediately picked up the fraudulence of the think tanks. We have them in Canada, too: the Fraser Institute, The Macdonald-Laurier Institute and other heavily funded propaganda organs. Jason Kenny, in Alberta, is planning on creating one to promote fossil fuels. These well funded think tanks all have an agenda and the studies they fund exclude what might yield an undesirable result. They control the data sets and if a study actually does yield a result they don't want, the bury it and it never gets published. They ride on the image of the impartiality of educated experts but the experts are rented prostitutes. They are chosen beforehand for their known biases and they are paid handsomly. There will always be such people.

Modern think tanks have become a species of fake news. They corrupt the trust we used to have in experts. They are anti-democratic.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,723 Posts
I’m of the mindset that Trump is such a threat to many of the norms of governing and is pushing further and further into the realm of the Authoritarian, that I feel that the most prudent thing to do for the Dems is to nominate the most easily electable candidate. Period.

If Biden came on, and announced he would run for one term to act as a stabilizing force if elected... then step aside, think it would be the perfect scenario.

Then he could nominate someone who is more progressive to be VP and have them ready to step into those shoes in 2024.

Mind you I still think Gavin Newsom will be POTUS at some point. However that might be 2028.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,352 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,533 ·
I'm of the mindset that Trump is such a threat to many of the norms of governing and is pushing further and further into the realm of the Authoritarian, that I feel that the most prudent thing to do for the Dems is to nominate the most easily electable candidate. Period.

If Biden came on, and announced he would run for one term to act as a stabilizing force if elected... then step aside, think it would be the perfect scenario.

Then he could nominate someone who is more progressive to be VP and have them ready to step into those shoes in 2024.

Mind you I still think Gavin Newsom will be POTUS at some point. However that might be 2028.
I can respect that opinion. I just think Democratic voters are tired of it all. They are not just tired of how Republicans and the Trump white house are running things, they are also tired of the status quo and the shrinking of the middle class, as much of the people who were in this class are now living at the poverty level. Yes, the unemployment rate is at historic lows (Thanks to the Obama economy that Trump inherited), but the jobs out there are mostly shit and pay low wages (and this may be the result of the Gig economy that we're in). The Income inequality between the Wealthy and the middle class is just too great.

Democratic voters want major changes. The 2018 midterms proved this. It didn't just prove what Americans want, it also proves that Democratic politicians no longer need to play to the middle. They no longer need to seek out corporate donors and therefore sell out to corporate Interest. The Midterm elections proved that if you are one to fight for progressive issues, the Democratic voters will come out to support you.

I simply believe the easy path forward is for Democratic politicians to fight for the progressive issues that Bernie "has ALWAYS" promoted. Bernie lost the 2016 Democratic primaries because the DCCC put their thumb on the scale for establishment candidate that was Hilary Clinton). The DCCC has promised new changes this time around to make it fair for all candidates.

2020 has to be about having your cake and eating it too. Democrats just can't just be fighting to win, they need to be fighting to win + have real change. I just don't see Biden representing real change in my opinion.

djino
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
17,425 Posts
The American norm has deteriorated so much, that bold 'new' ideas on the progressive side stand a much better chance at fixing issues than the incrementalism of the Establishment Democrats (who lean too far right on fiscal issues, and burnish their image by leaning left on a few key social ones.)

The USA needs Univeral Health Care to offset the falling 'purchasing power' and stagnant middle and lower class incomes.
The USA needs big estate tax and taxes on stock-market gains (particular the 2nd and 3rd order derivates, futures, and puts)
The USA needs infrastructure, major NEW DEAL stuff, and the progressive GREEN NEW DEAL is the only starting framework I've seen from LEFT or RIGHT policy standpoint.
The USA needs to stop building prisons and start building livable communities (not gated ones) - and infrastructure (water, electricity, rail) are key to this.
The USA needs to keep massive amounts of money from flowing into their political system.

Bernie seems to have a handle on these things moreso than any of the other Democrat hopefuls.
Biden is a chump, I have no idea what his appeal is...nor his policy standpoints. He has a background life story that he tells a lot, that's about it. <--- This is not leadership, this is 'story time.'
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,998 Posts
If they want to
The American norm has deteriorated so much, that bold 'new' ideas on the progressive side stand a much better chance at fixing issues than the incrementalism of the Establishment Democrats (who lean too far right on fiscal issues, and burnish their image by leaning left on a few key social ones.)

The USA needs Univeral Health Care to offset the falling 'purchasing power' and stagnant middle and lower class incomes.
The USA needs big estate tax and taxes on stock-market gains (particular the 2nd and 3rd order derivates, futures, and puts)
The USA needs infrastructure, major NEW DEAL stuff, and the progressive GREEN NEW DEAL is the only starting framework I've seen from LEFT or RIGHT policy standpoint.
The USA needs to stop building prisons and start building livable communities (not gated ones) - and infrastructure (water, electricity, rail) are key to this.
The USA needs to keep massive amounts of money from flowing into their political system.

Bernie seems to have a handle on these things moreso than any of the other Democrat hopefuls.
Biden is a chump, I have no idea what his appeal is...nor his policy standpoints. He has a background life story that he tells a lot, that's about it.
I prefer Bernie yes, but Americans are a different breed of people . Biden offers them STABILITY. I prefer Bernie yes,but Biden has a better shot of winning. Older folks like stability and know him to be a stable choice. He has that over Trump and Bernie, I also think Biden would pick up more of the Black vote being a Obama era vice president. Older white folks will also support him and that scares the shit out of republicans
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,352 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,536 ·
If they want to
I prefer Bernie yes, but Americans are a different breed of people . Biden offers them STABILITY. I prefer Bernie yes,but Biden has a better shot of winning. Older folks like stability and know him to be a stable choice. He has that over Trump and Bernie, I also think Biden would pick up more of the Black vote being a Obama era vice president. Older white folks will also support him and that scares the sh..t out of reptilians
Are there a lot of older Republican voters out there that would be willing to vote for Biden over Trump? Would this number over come the number of progressive democrats who would stay home or vote 3rd party because Biden isn't speaking to progressive issues?

I'm sure there will be voters who are nostalgic and looking to Biden to continue the Obama era, I just do not believe that is a something you can bank on to happen with any significance to win a presidential election..

Lets also not forget that Biden would likely lose a lot of Female voters as we are now in this MeToo era if we look back to how he handled the Clearance Thomas confirmations specifically with Anita Hill (which was a 2 decade earlier example of the recent Kavanaugh confirmation with Christine Blasey Ford).

Lets also not forget that Biden was in support of terrible Bills like 'The Defense of Marriage Act" which forbid the U.S. government from recognizing same-sex relationships.

Lets also not forget that Biden was in support of the terrible 1994 Crime Bill that has lead to an insurgence of African American incarceration.

Lets also not forget that Biden voted in support of the Iraq war.

I'm not trying to make this a Hate Biden campaign post, I'm just suggesting that Biden is not likely to get the support in today's America that he may have had in the past, due to his voting record. Yes he has evolved on many of the issues above (like the Gay Marriage issue, but that didn't happen until recent). Biden has always been one to be on the wrong side of many issues and then evolve after public opinion has changed. Whereas other candidates (like Bernie Sanders) who have also been in politics for decades have ALWAYS been on the correct side of issues even when they were not so popular.

Biden is going to have to explain his voting record should he actually jump into the race. And I'm sorry to say that there are just much more interesting candidates out there in the current field of 18 Candidates. I feel as though Biden would simply be banking on his name recognition, and I don't believe that is enough. Putting Biden out there as a nominee, would be no different to putting out Clinton as a nominee. I see no difference between the two and we know how Clinton did in 2016.

djino
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,998 Posts
Are there a lot of older Republican voters out there that would be willing to vote for Biden over Trump? Would this number over come the number of progressive democrats who would stay home or vote 3rd party because Biden isn't speaking to progressive issues?

I'm sure there will be voters who are nostalgic and looking to Biden to continue the Obama era, I just do not believe that is a something you can bank on to happen with any significance to win a presidential election..

Lets also not forget that Biden would likely lose a lot of Female voters as we are now in this MeToo era if we look back to how he handled the Clearance Thomas confirmations specifically with Anita Hill (which was a 2 decade earlier example of the recent Kavanaugh confirmation with Christine Blasey Ford).

Lets also not forget that Biden was in support of terrible Bills like 'The Defense of Marriage Act" which forbid the U.S. government from recognizing same-sex relationships.

Lets also not forget that Biden was in support of the terrible 1994 Crime Bill that has lead to an insurgence of African American incarceration.

Lets also not forget that Biden voted in support of the Iraq war.

I'm not trying to make this a Hate Biden campaign post, I'm just suggesting that Biden is not likely to get the support in today's America that he may have had in the past, due to his voting record. Yes he has evolved on many of the issues above (like the Gay Marriage issue, but that didn't happen until recent). Biden has always been one to be on the wrong side of many issues and then evolve after public opinion has changed. Whereas other candidates (like Bernie Sanders) who have also been in politics for decades have ALWAYS been on the correct side of issues even when they were not so popular.

Biden is going to have to explain his voting record should he actually jump into the race. And I'm sorry to say that there are just much more interesting candidates out there in the current field of 18 Candidates. I feel as though Biden would simply be banking on his name recognition, and I don't believe that is enough. Putting Biden out there as a nominee, would be no different to putting out Clinton as a nominee. I see no difference between the two and we know how Clinton did in 2016.

djino
These are insider issues,for people heavily entrenched in politics. Your giving Americans to much credit most of them are uneducated and don't look that deep into things. Biden / Harris would be stellar
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
17,425 Posts
These are insider issues,for people heavily entrenched in politics. Your giving Americans to much credit most of them are uneducated and don't look that deep into things. Biden / Harris would be stellar
Pragmatic Incrementalism is strangling the US which has always been capitalism on steroids. It needs a shot in the arm (but not the current cynaide-laced fentanyl one from TRUMP), not a mild valium (Biden).

Canada and Northern Europe have slightly better/softer systems, with larger middle classes, that do not quite need the overhaul that the USA is in desparate need of right now.

Britain needs to shit or get off the pot. Good luck UK!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,998 Posts
I think the biggest mistakes democrat s make is gearing there campaign towards educated logical good people. When the bread and butter in the states is to catch the voter that still thinks wrestlemania is real. Get the mouth breathing vote and you win

Capture this vote game set match
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
17,425 Posts
I think the biggest mistakes democrat s make is gearing there campaign towards educated logical good people. When the bread and butter in the states is to catch the voter that still thinks wrestlemania is real. Get the mouth breathing vote and you win

Capture this vote game set match
These 'Americans are Stupid' videos are highly curated/edited for maximum effect. But yea, there is always plenty dumb to go around....
 
1521 - 1540 of 2469 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top