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Should Melb. share drivers make a group approach to Uber to negotiate a rate increase?

  • Yes

    Votes: 19 90.5%
  • No

    Votes: 2 9.5%
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Trying out a poll to see how it flies.

It says in our contract that we can approach Uber to negotiate rates....may seem like a pie in the sky, but there are some very good reasons to actually try do it:

1. Having officially approached Uber about a rate increase, we can then let the world/press know the results of the discussion
2. The ATO keeps telling us that these matters are for us and the Facilitator to work out between ourselves...if we actually make a formal attempt to do this, we then have recourse to approach the Govt or ATO to say that we have tried it, and share the results.
3. You have to start somewhere.
4. Uber is getting bad press and could use a good news story right about now...maybe a genuine hourly income guarantee until we know the decision of the court case, or ask for a straight out rate increase, it would look great for them and let the latte sipping politically correct feel just a smidge better about using Uber again....Uber might be tempted to take advantage of this: a good news story of how they do negotiate with drivers: right about now, it's a cheap good news story for them as Melb drivers are a small population
 

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The better idea would be to follow the French taxi drivers approach - close down roads, burn tires, overturn cars and bash the crap out of a taxi drivers car.

There is no point in making a group approach to Uber when there are 5000 drivers lined up at the office ready to sign up as drivers.

Maybe don't go the French approach, but maybe get drivers to pool some money together and park one of those great big mobile advertising vehicles outside the Uber offices with something like "Uber lies to drivers" in bold print all over it?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
There is a question of how we would approach:

1. Make an appointment and send a couple of representatives to negotiate
2. write a group letter and all sign
3. all send the same or similar email
4. show up as a group to the Melb office

I think a combo of 2., 3. then 1. in that order, then if these don't work, try 4.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
If you wanna sign or sending Uber individual identical email, I got about 20~50 drivers from Asian back ground
Fantastic! May I please have a look? Post or convo...
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Check my previous thread, my email to Uber actually got copied and resent to Uber by multiple Asian driver from a closed Wechat group.
Yes, I remember it. Did you have any thoughts on the suggestions I made?
 

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*Uber should collect and pay GST before paying out to driver
*Driver should have annual summary including mileage, fare, toll, GST, pay out
*Increase fare to compensate GST

But, I have to say it's a small bunch of us fighting for the majority Indian driver don't give a shit.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
*Uber should collect and pay GST before paying out to driver
*Driver should have annual summary including mileage, fare, toll, GST, pay out
*Increase fare to compensate GST
OK, no worries.

Some of the most influential people on the forum are from that part of the world ;) You might be surprised.

It is great that you have been able to network with so many other peeps and get a group email into Uber. Have you had any response?

May we please use some of your email as a basis for the group email we are planning to send after this poll is finished? It seems to be slowing down now. I'd be very pleased if we could collaborate together on the final for this email if you'd be interested?
 

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Feel free to utilize my email. It got reply from Uber still the bla bla bla Bearcat BS from Uber. There are reasons: 1,Uber too arrogant, 2, the number of driver questioning still too small 3, the Melbourne office PPL are ***** dare not to go up the ladder and tell his boss.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Feel free to utilize my email. It got reply from Uber still the bla bla bla Bearcat BS from Uber. There are reasons: 1,Uber too arrogant, 2, the number of driver questioning still too small 3, the Melbourne office PPL are ***** dare not to go up the ladder and tell his boss.
Ok, well that's a result,

Now we know the sample size was too small. And somebody has tried. Lets try again with more peeps and an email that most can agree on. Keep it general maybe? Just say we want to open a dialog re rates, as per our contract.

Hopefully we can gather more "senders" or "signatures", ask everyone to spread the word.

I know how to get to the slightly higher ups: Someone who says he can "flick requests" to the boss. I made contact when I first signed up with a letter I wrote to the ATO and now I have phone number and email.

;)
 

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hi peoeple my uber buddies call me a sceptic but all this talk is empty crap the core of the matter we r not dealing with LYFT but the company wich has surpassed every thing in the market of moving people from A TO B.
Indian drivers get the centerlink payments work part time as couriers for Aus post and full time ubering so there is more than plenty of drivers at any time complain or not gst or not they dont give a rats ass
 

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No, anyone taking centerlink will not dare to receive any formal transaction. ThESE guys just poor dude borrowed and buy a new car to Uber. Need to drive millions of hours to pay back the car.
 

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*Uber should collect and pay GST before paying out to driver
*Driver should have annual summary including mileage, fare, toll, GST, pay out
*Increase fare to compensate GST

But, I have to say it's a small bunch of us fighting for the majority Indian driver don't give a shit.
THis is the be
*Uber should collect and pay GST before paying out to driver
*Driver should have annual summary including mileage, fare, toll, GST, pay out
*Increase fare to compensate GST

But, I have to say it's a small bunch of us fighting for the majority Indian driver don't give a shit.
The BEST comment i have seen on this forum- Hats off to you Markinau. A simple and concise solution to the most controversial UBER issue in Australia atm. FFS UBER sort your SH*T out and get drivers back on the road- Add GST to the final fare- include it in the fare summary- AND then drivers will pay the f**ing GST. Lets move on and drive.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
THis is the be

The BEST comment i have seen on this forum- Hats off to you Markinau. A simple and concise solution to the most controversial UBER issue in Australia atm. FFS UBER sort your SH*T out and get drivers back on the road- Add GST to the final fare- include it in the fare summary- AND then drivers will pay the f**ing GST. Lets move on and drive.
I wish it was possible.

But the ATO says it is the drivers who must pay the GST, not Uber. As much as I agree that it would be the best solution for drivers, Uber will never pay GST directly on our behalves to the ATO because the law says share drivers have to do it (for now) and the GST is not applicable to them because they are an overseas based company.

(Heaps of share drivers GST questions answered here: https://www.ato.gov.au/business/gst...cing-and-your-tax-obligations/?page=1#Drivers )

I think the solution will be a rate rise, one that compensates us for the GST and fuel price increases. Whether that is a KM/base rate/minute rate rise (100%GST taxable) or a GENUINE hourly income guarantee that is easily achievable for drivers (Possible benefit: Legally grey area because the ATO has not yet gotten back to drivers about GST on this type of income. So far, the ATO has said the GST applies to fares: well hourly income guarantee is not fares is it?).

Uber might put in place GST invoicing in the app, so that we do not meed to supply invoices ourselves, we should also ask for this.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
The better idea would be to follow the French taxi drivers approach - close down roads, burn tires, overturn cars and bash the crap out of a taxi drivers car.

There is no point in making a group approach to Uber when there are 5000 drivers lined up at the office ready to sign up as drivers.

Maybe don't go the French approach, but maybe get drivers to pool some money together and park one of those great big mobile advertising vehicles outside the Uber offices with something like "Uber lies to drivers" in bold print all over it?


Fair Work Australia produces this: Independent Contractors The essential handbook where I got the following quote:


"As a "hirer" you are protected from unauthorised industrial action by independent contractors. It is also unlawful for unions to threaten or take unauthorised industrial action against you."
 

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It's not about increasing rates. It's about changing the whole way they do things.

Let's get real here. Uber's IT specialists has the knowledge to upgrade the app for Aussie users if they choose to.
There needs to be a couple of changes and fields that should be added.

Divide the payment into 2 portions.
1st is the fare payable to the driver which has the GST.
2nd could be an app fee payable to Uber B.V.

Let's look at a scenario here.
Rider get's a lift and it costs them ummm let's say $118

Now we break the $118 down.
$80 was the fare to the driver.
$8 is the GST component which the driver must include in their BASE.
$20 is the Uber app fee which is not part of the fare and payable directly to Uber.
$10 is for tolls which is GST inclusive and paid by rider to the driver.

Surely this is the way to go and a great step forward for Uber to co-operate with the ATO.

BUT it has a flaw!!!

This would mean that Uber would need to ensure all their drivers have an ABN and be GST registerded.

This would probably mean Uber would need to take 5 steps backward before they can move forward.
Your thoughts.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 · (Edited)
It's not about increasing rates. It's about changing the whole way they do things.

Let's get real here. Uber's IT specialists has the knowledge to upgrade the app for Aussie users if they choose to.
There needs to be a couple of changes and fields that should be added.

Divide the payment into 2 portions.
1st is the fare payable to the driver which has the GST.
2nd could be an app fee payable to Uber B.V.

Let's look at a scenario here.
Rider get's a lift and it costs them ummm let's say $118

Now we break the $118 down.
$80 was the fare to the driver.
$8 is the GST component which the driver must include in their BASE.
$20 is the Uber app fee which is not part of the fare and payable directly to Uber.
$10 is for tolls which is GST inclusive and paid by rider to the driver.

Surely this is the way to go and a great step forward for Uber to co-operate with the ATO.

BUT it has a flaw!!!

This would mean that Uber would need to ensure all their drivers have an ABN and be GST registered.

This would probably mean Uber would need to take 5 steps backward before they can move forward.
Your thoughts.
Hi there Ron,

I see what you are saying in your scenario. It's a good solution, except that the ATO wants 10% GST on the Gross fare before any division. While I agree that it would be better if your sum were closer to the case, the ATO would view that they were dipping out on %20 of their GST collection, if you know what I mean. This is because they can't collect the balance of the GST from the Uber cut, because they are GST exempt as an overseas company. Not saying I like it but there it is. The GST ruling is currently being challenged by Uber in the courts so it may not remain the case that we need to worry about GST anyway.

SDA is proposing a new tax on all OS based share ride app providers that will effectively act like a GST but isn't, so that then they can pay 10% tax on their cut and we can pay a simple 10% GST on our share only.

Unfortunately this is the current scenario, as you are probably aware:

To find GST, you must divided the gross figure by 11:
Fee is $108+$10 for tolls
$108/11= $9.82 GST
$108/5 (20%)= $21.60 Uber
You are left with $76.85* to cover all costs except $10 for tolls (should work out full reimbursement but there is some dispute as to whether this is true).

*There are small GST input credtis you can claim back on your other costs (but not on the biggest cost, the Uber cut) plus income tax deductions.
 
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