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Have you done an analysis to discover your true income after ALL expenses?

  • Yes

    Votes: 17 81.0%
  • No

    Votes: 3 14.3%
  • I would like to, please post the .xls spreadsheet

    Votes: 3 14.3%
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Seriously people. We're all getting *ucked here. I'm uploading my findings after experimenting as an UBER driver for one week. I accepted EVERY request and provided TOP service. The results were disheartening to say the least. I assert nobody is making money in ANY semi-rural market.

I’ve included some important notes below.

In my opinion and reviewing my findings I think UBER (a $69 Billion dollar company) is extorting money from unwitting contract drivers worldwide to fund its future procurement of an autonomous fleet of driverless vehicles which will put out of work all those who built the company in the first place.... US!

Assumptions made:

· Using Edmunds data I derived the per mile cost ($.72/mi) of operating my vehicle based on a $24,000 purchase price and driving it 15,000 miles a year with an average price of gas at $2.35/gal. This per mile rate includes insurance, registration, gas, maintenance, depreciation etc..

o I was generous to average the 5 year cost per mile instead of using the first year value of $.90/mi, etc.
o I was generous to use a $2.35/gal price for fuel even though I currently pay $2.57-$2.77/gal.
o I was generous to not use the $85k purchase price of my car in the analysis (I wanted to base it on the average cost of a car that would qualify to be driven for a rideshare company).

· I did not include the “lost wages” for the number of unpaid “on-call” hours (31.9) whose value is not included in the “pre-tax income” column.

· Self-employment tax in NM is around $15% which would have to be paid against any final earnings (as well as Federal) in the “pre-tax income” column.

Of special note:

· UBER will not enable “suv” or “select” in the Santa Fe market. I believe this is also true for all semi-rural markets that they operate in.

o Uber x pays:
- $1.10/mi and $.20/minute in Santa Fe
- $.85/mi and $.13/minute in Albuquerque
· Uber Select in ABQ pays $2/mile and $.25/minute
· UBER does not allow a user to tip in the app and most drivers don’t carry cash.

Perceived dangers of UBER operating in NM (or anywhere):

· Damaging to all other taxi/bus/train/ride companies
· Exploiting the unwitting
· Funding a company whose CEO Travis Kalanick’s stated goal is: “to replace Uber’s more than 1 million human drivers with robot drivers—as quickly as possible.”


Please feel free to call or email for any further info.
 

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With UberX ideally you need to operate around .20 per mile. The best car is probably a 5-7 year old 100k+ mile car with good mpg which you paid with cash no more than about $4-5k. Even then, it's probably no going to be that good. Maybe you can tweak what rides you take and where you drive to pick up extra surge and more paid miles.

If you just look at the 50 hours you spent for $600 (before car expenses) and 1,000 miles, it will be hard to make it worthwhile. Even if you get down to .20 per mile plus other expenses, maybe you clear $300 for 50 hours = $6 per hour. $6 per hour is partly for the extra risks (accidents, tickets, crime, damages, etc) you take driving versus doing something far less dangerous. In other words, at best you may be driving for close to free. At worst, a loss.

If your rate is 1.10 there's a good likelihood it has room for rate cuts. In my market, the rarity of select calls makes it unlikely to be worth using a higher value car. If there is a time where one class gets profitable, usually within 2-3 months it will get saturated down to make it hard to get calls.

Also, forget about self employment or other taxes. On UberX it will be hard to show a tax profit after deducting for the standard mileage rate and other expenses.
 

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Seriously people. We're all getting *ucked here. I'm uploading my findings after experimenting as an UBER driver for one week. I accepted EVERY request and provided TOP service. The results were disheartening to say the least. I assert nobody is making money in ANY semi-rural market.

I've included some important notes below.

In my opinion and reviewing my findings I think UBER (a $69 Billion dollar company) is extorting money from unwitting contract drivers worldwide to fund its future procurement of an autonomous fleet of driverless vehicles which will put out of work all those who built the company in the first place.... US!

Assumptions made:

· Using Edmunds data I derived the per mile cost ($.72/mi) of operating my vehicle based on a $24,000 purchase price and driving it 15,000 miles a year with an average price of gas at $2.35/gal. This per mile rate includes insurance, registration, gas, maintenance, depreciation etc..

o I was generous to average the 5 year cost per mile instead of using the first year value of $.90/mi, etc.
o I was generous to use a $2.35/gal price for fuel even though I currently pay $2.57-$2.77/gal.
o I was generous to not use the $85k purchase price of my car in the analysis (I wanted to base it on the average cost of a car that would qualify to be driven for a rideshare company).

· I did not include the "lost wages" for the number of unpaid "on-call" hours (31.9) whose value is not included in the "pre-tax income" column.

· Self-employment tax in NM is around $15% which would have to be paid against any final earnings (as well as Federal) in the "pre-tax income" column.

Of special note:

· UBER will not enable "suv" or "select" in the Santa Fe market. I believe this is also true for all semi-rural markets that they operate in.

o Uber x pays:
- $1.10/mi and $.20/minute in Santa Fe
- $.85/mi and $.13/minute in Albuquerque
· Uber Select in ABQ pays $2/mile and $.25/minute
· UBER does not allow a user to tip in the app and most drivers don't carry cash.

Perceived dangers of UBER operating in NM (or anywhere):

· Damaging to all other taxi/bus/train/ride companies
· Exploiting the unwitting
· Funding a company whose CEO Travis Kalanick's stated goal is: "to replace Uber's more than 1 million human drivers with robot drivers-as quickly as possible."

Please feel free to call or email for any further info.
Uber Drivers subsidise Uber more than investors
 

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Your problems:
1- Your car is worth too much, even at $24K, therefore depreciating too much. My expenses are much less than standard mileage because I drive an 06 car that I got with 150,000 miles on it.
2- Car washes. Seriously, I've never paid for a car wash before in the life of my car.
3- Meals. You're gonna eat no matter what job you do. Sure some meals are deductible but I actually think it is BS.
4- Mints & Waters. Most riders don't take these anyway. I buy these, but I bet if I didn't buy them I'd still have a high enough rating to drive.
5- Lost time. Not really a fair column to count. Sure, you have an opportunity cost, but just because you could be making money doing something else doesn't mean you can subtract that from what you made.
6- You accepted EVERY request. You shouldn't accept requests that are too far away, especially with your cost per miles for your super expensive car. If there is surge, you should be more selective. If you are really rural, maybe you can't make minimum wage, but if you are selective you can probably eliminate trips that will cost you money.
 

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Your problems:
1- Your car is worth too much, even at $24K, therefore depreciating too much. My expenses are much less than standard mileage because I drive an 06 car that I got with 150,000 miles on it.
2- Car washes. Seriously, I've never paid for a car wash before in the life of my car.
3- Meals. You're gonna eat no matter what job you do. Sure some meals are deductible but I actually think it is BS.
4- Mints & Waters. Most riders don't take these anyway. I buy these, but I bet if I didn't buy them I'd still have a high enough rating to drive.
5- Lost time. Not really a fair column to count. Sure, you have an opportunity cost, but just because you could be making money doing something else doesn't mean you can subtract that from what you made.
6- You accepted EVERY request. You shouldn't accept requests that are too far away, especially with your cost per miles for your super expensive car. If there is surge, you should be more selective. If you are really rural, maybe you can't make minimum wage, but if you are selective you can probably eliminate trips that will cost you money.
Exactly. People drive Uber with new cars they have payments on, then ***** about depreciation. Dumb. Car washes? I got a $20 monthly pass for unlimited washes for the winter, but once spring comes that will go away. Meals? You eat every day anyway. You probably would've been eating out for lunch every day at a regular job. Stay close to home and eat leftovers for lunch. Lost time? Ask a car salesman about lost time where they make zero. Once accepting every request is just dumb.
 

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Back when I worked a regular job I would listen to my coworkers whine about how they never had enough money yet everyday they would come back from lunch with fast food. I never understood that. I'd rather bring food from a grocery store. Better quality food AND less expensive!
 

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If you buy a car for $26,000, put 250,000 miles on it, and sell it for $1,000, it has depreciated $0.10 per mile over its entire life.
But, if its new(er), its depreciating a hell of a lot more.

I bought a 2007 ford focas, 77,000 miles for $2,750.
If I put 137,500 mile on it before it gets crushed into toasters, that's 2 cents a mile.
(214,500 total miles)

I make 8 cents a mile more than you automatically, and I do it with a $22,000 less than your investment.
It gets 26 mpg ubering.
I just took it to Virginia (highway) it gets 36 mpg.
It is cheap to maintain, insure, replace parts, etc.

If you are uberingX with a car that cost you more than $5000, you are a fool (well a bigger fool than the rest of us, who are also fools for ubering).

Admittedly, my maintenance costs will be higher (new brakes, tune up, headlights, windshield wipers already and 8,000 miles in).
Uber is for those of us with 10 year old cars who are willing to work for minimum wage without insurance, job security, social security contributions, taking all risk of destroying vehicle, accidental death of pax or other that results in manslaughter charges, potholes that destroy vehicle, etc.

If you learned your lesson, and only lost money, and didn't end up injured or in jail before you quit, then you are better off than those of us still doing it.
 

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The issue is I'm sure at $0.70 you are assuming full cost of your monthly car payment?

As a full timer, sure, you have to consider that.

But as a part timer? I have a full time job during the week that I need a car for. That job covers my car payment and insurance.

So by doing Uber on the weekends, my earnings do not need to directly correlate to the cost of my vehicle. All I have to consider is the extra costs associated with putting more miles on my vehicle.

What is that?

Depreciation: I bought my car with somewhere around 55k miles and I put in 15k since I bought it last year. About 12k of that was for Uber. The difference in my KBB value was negligible in that time frame.

Insurance: Premium barely went up after adding ride share endorsement.

Oil change: I had to get one extra oil change in that 5 month period above as my car doesn't require an oil change for 6k miles, so an extra $50 spent.

Tires: My tires were new when I purchased my vehicle and will last 60k. In 60k in driving, $600 in new tires won't stress my wallet. With my average driving, I still have 18 months worth of EARNING before I'll need new tires.

Flat Tire: I had to repair my tire as I hit a nail. $35 and it could happen to any of us, with or without Uber.

New Battery: I was stupid and killed my battery. Oops, $150 and it could happen to any of us, with or without Uber but now I have a 6 year warranty on my battery.

So not sure how you can possibly consider yourself losing $300 a weekend, but if you are, you are certainly doing something wrong...
 

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2/22 You drove 222 miles for a $57.44 payout. How is that even possible unless you doing laps around the city for sh**ts and giggles?
your miles per pay is really wrong.

you include food costs. Unless you work at a restaurant, your food does not come included with your shift pay.

phone. While most drivers are not smart enough to include the cost of their phone and minutes on their taxes, you would have a phone anyway, so this "cost" is bogus.

supplies: 1 week and you are making uber signs and giving out mints? And it cost you a $1 an hour!

Uber is not for $85,000 cars. Uber is not for $8,500 cars. Uber is for $850 cars.

"I accepted EVERY request and provided TOP service."
Wrong. Never accept requests unless they are close enough that it is worth it. Never accept pool requests unless it is a giant surge. Never provide top service, the customer is not paying for it. It just leads to ridiculous expectations. I see no cancels? Cancel after 5 minutes and collect your fee. I would happy cancelling 4 times an hour and not putting the wear and tare on my car or the miles. I do not want customers in my car, I want cancel fees. If you do not like destination or it is pulling you in the wrong direction for a money loser, say "sorry, the next driver will take you" and cancel yourself and leave the problem to the next driver.

If you are at the address 12 Main street and the pax says I am sorry I meant to put in 42 main street 100 yards away, say OK I will be right there, then wait and collect the cancel fee. The pax will ping again, ignore it, and the next driver gets the angry pax while you collect the next drivers ping because he was shuttling around your cancel fee pax. Thats a win for you. Customer service costs money with no reward. Sh***tting on your pax provides you with a financial reward. And thats what Uber wants because they designed it that way. Otherwise they would encourage tipping for service. They discourage it so service in not supplied.

Customer service gets you compliments. Thats like being sh***t on. No matter how many stars you have or five star reviews Uber will deactivate you tomorrow for one mistake after 5 years of perfect scores and compliments. Sh***t on your customers and take the long route because they are trying to sh***t on you, while Uber sh***ts on us all. You are one misunderstanding away from being deactivated anyway.
 

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Seriously people. We're all getting *ucked here. I'm uploading my findings after experimenting as an UBER driver for one week. I accepted EVERY request and provided TOP service. The results were disheartening to say the least. I assert nobody is making money in ANY semi-rural market.

I've included some important notes below.

In my opinion and reviewing my findings I think UBER (a $69 Billion dollar company) is extorting money from unwitting contract drivers worldwide to fund its future procurement of an autonomous fleet of driverless vehicles which will put out of work all those who built the company in the first place.... US!

Assumptions made:

· Using Edmunds data I derived the per mile cost ($.72/mi) of operating my vehicle based on a $24,000 purchase price and driving it 15,000 miles a year with an average price of gas at $2.35/gal. This per mile rate includes insurance, registration, gas, maintenance, depreciation etc..

o I was generous to average the 5 year cost per mile instead of using the first year value of $.90/mi, etc.
o I was generous to use a $2.35/gal price for fuel even though I currently pay $2.57-$2.77/gal.
o I was generous to not use the $85k purchase price of my car in the analysis (I wanted to base it on the average cost of a car that would qualify to be driven for a rideshare company).

· I did not include the "lost wages" for the number of unpaid "on-call" hours (31.9) whose value is not included in the "pre-tax income" column.

· Self-employment tax in NM is around $15% which would have to be paid against any final earnings (as well as Federal) in the "pre-tax income" column.

Of special note:

· UBER will not enable "suv" or "select" in the Santa Fe market. I believe this is also true for all semi-rural markets that they operate in.

o Uber x pays:
- $1.10/mi and $.20/minute in Santa Fe
- $.85/mi and $.13/minute in Albuquerque
· Uber Select in ABQ pays $2/mile and $.25/minute
· UBER does not allow a user to tip in the app and most drivers don't carry cash.

Perceived dangers of UBER operating in NM (or anywhere):

· Damaging to all other taxi/bus/train/ride companies
· Exploiting the unwitting
· Funding a company whose CEO Travis Kalanick's stated goal is: "to replace Uber's more than 1 million human drivers with robot drivers-as quickly as possible."

Please feel free to call or email for any further info.
72 cents per mile for a $24,000 vehicle is very high. I'd like to see how you came up with that. If you're using the car payment in your calculations, it should be for a $24,000 vehicle, not the $85,000 one you say you're driving.

And if you ARE driving an $85,000 vehicle for Uberx you are certifiably nuts. The only exception that makes sense would be using destination filter to and from your real job.
 

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72 cents per mile for a $24,000 vehicle is very high. I'd like to see how you came up with that. If you're using the car payment in your calculations, it should be for a $24,000 vehicle, not the $85,000 one you say you're driving.

And if you ARE driving an $85,000 vehicle for Uberx you are certifiably nuts. The only exception that makes sense would be using destination filter to and from your real job.
As usual the fuzzer is spot on. I can't imagine how anyone would wanna driver a $24,000 vehicle *(let alone 85k), for uberX rates.
 
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